7/8/2024

224. Dr. Cate Shanahan about Dark Calories, Ozempic, lies about seed oils, what a processed food really is and why it's killing us (English)

Dr. Kate Shanahan, a physician, discusses her new book "Dark Calories," focusing on the harmful effects of industrial seed oils on health. She argues that these oils, including corn, canola, and soy oil, are the root cause of many chronic diseases due to their promotion of oxidative stress and damage to mitochondria. She criticizes the American Heart Association's promotion of vegetable oils and the medical establishment's reliance on cholesterol as a health indicator. She also explores the unintended consequences of Ozempic, a weight-loss drug, and emphasizes the importance of addressing metabolic health through dietary changes, particularly avoiding seed oils. Shanahan provides practical advice on building a healthy diet, focusing on whole foods and natural ingredients, and highlights the importance of educating children on healthy eating habits.

00:00

Relationship Podden answers relationship questions every Thursday with fresh challenges and expert insights to optimize health through biohacking strategies.

07:14

Define metabolism, the importance of healthy fats, the dangers of vegetable oils, and their impact on mitochondrial health, with emphasis on preventing diseases and supporting optimal health through dietary choices.

01:17:33

Insulin resistance and the importance of a healthy diet for children's well-being and long-term health.

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Transcript

New episode of Relationship Podden, out now. Relationship Podden doesn't take summer vacation. We answer all kinds of questions about relationships that come to us. It can be a problem with a husband-daughter relationship, the boring colleague, the sour neighbor, or the hopeless girlfriend. Fresh challenges for everyone and every Thursday throughout the summer. Listen to Relationship Podden for free, where you listen to podcasts.

Hi everyone, welcome to us. We are Biohacking Girls, your podcast for optimal health. We are two girls behind the wheel. This is Monica.

And this is all. We are biohacking colleagues and put together our experiences and knowledge to inspire you to take hold of biohacking to optimize your health.

We feel like putting a glass of water on trends and latest research and talk to the world's top experts in training, life coaching, health and biohacking. Are you ready to start with concrete hacks, listen to your own body and take a hold of your health-related journey with us? We want natural approach to our health and we talk to both men and women.

You can feel free to send us a message under this podcast and hit the bell with a good star. You can also find us on Instagram and Facebook. Are you ready? Welcome! Today we are so lucky to have with us Dr. Kate Shanahan again. And she is actually one of the episodes that is most listened to on our podcast.

Yes, and that has given so many good feedbacks and curious questions to answer. We decided that now, when she comes with a new book, we must have her back again on the podcast. And that's very nice, because she is very big and popular, and hosts the most important podcasts within the biohacking environment, with Dave Asprey, Ben Greenfield and Drew. So we have made some thoughts around what she has been doing since the last episode.

Yes, and we have received a lot of feedback. People ask, and you listeners ask a lot about oils. You are wondering about this with fatty hormones, and what we should do to not be hungry, and this with snacks. We get a lot of questions after the episode with Dr. Kate, and today I think we are going to talk about a lot of what you are wondering about.

And what about this with insulin resistance? What does that mean? And what do the Norwegian health authorities recommend using fat sources? And how smart is that really? And this with french fries and oils in the fast food industry?

You just have to look forward to hearing that, because did you know that one large portion of French fries, which is made from vegetable oils, gives you as much poison as smoking 24 cigarettes? We have to hear about this. In today's episode, we are going to summarize a little bit about what vegetable oils are, which ones to avoid, which oils we can eat, why they oxidize easier, and how they are placed around our fatty organs.

Yes, and they are found in all UPMAT. And what happens to our ration on 3 and 6? Kate knows a lot, because she has been doing this for over 15 years now. She also thinks that this with vegetable oils is what makes us crave sugar. And not in turn. Even if we eat sugar, we don't crave oils. But eating oils makes us crave this sugar.

So this new ultra-possessed food we're talking about and the vegetabiles that are chemically produced, how do they affect us? And now Dr. Kate Shanahan will turn to both doctors and researchers, because now it's really serious. Dr. Kate Shanahan is a doctor herself, and it was her own story and disease that made her eyes open for the vegetabiles.

Yes, and together with the NBA legend Gary Vitti, she has created this Pro Nutrition program for LA Lakers. So that's what we're going to talk about today. Dr. Kate Shannon lives and learns from her large library of knowledge from Florida, where she lives with her family.

Welcome to Biohacking Girls podcast.

Welcome back to us, Dr. Kate. What a pleasure and congrats on your new book. How are you? I'm so good. Yes, I'm very excited. This is my publication week. So thank you so much for having me on at this point. Have you been busy all week? Yeah, pretty busy. Yeah. And that's good. You better keep the mind focused all the time. But how has the book been received so far?

Well, so far, so good. You know, people just got it, right? So they're starting to read it. And one person told me it's a real page turner, which I loved hearing that. You know, another person said it's already a quarter of the way through it, which is amazing because it just arrived yesterday and it's about 400 pages. So that's good. So, so far, so good.

But yeah, I can't wait to see more reviews and see how if it's actually interesting book. So we just read the PDF version of your book. It's amazing. We can't wait to get a hard copy because we love to take notes and, you know, reflect more on all the details. So we are super excited to get it here to Norway soon, too. Great. Yes. Thanks.

Can't wait to see what you think. Yeah, but how does dark calories build on your previous books, The Deep Nutrition and The Fat Burn Fix? Yeah, great question. So with Deep Nutrition, what that book really does is it defines what is a human diet, right?

You know, I explore what is the common elements of all ancestral diets before the industrial era. All around the world, there were four common elements that I identified. So people used to eat a very similar diet, even though the ingredients would look different. It had the similar nutrients all over the world. And so the other thing that deep nutrition does is it

describes what is health. What does this optimal human diet do to our bodies? Well, it creates optimal health. And I also defined that. So I thought that was very important. And then my next book after that was the fat burn fix. And the fat burn fix is the first book

to define metabolism. Everybody's talking about metabolism and how you have to speed up or slow down or whatever your metabolism. And I actually define what metabolism is so we can have a more intelligent conversation about it. And I talk about how the junk foods and bad diet damages our metabolism and why we gain weight and how it has not so much to do with willpower, right? How basically when our metabolism is damaged,

You can't use willpower alone, right? It makes it very difficult. So you have to fix your metabolism. And it has to do with burning your body fat or not. And then so in this book, this is where dark calories, I dive into really the root cause of all disease by understanding how these horrible things in our food supply, the four ultra processed ingredients that make up

In America, people get 76% of their calories from just these four ultra processed ingredients. And vegetable oils are the worst of the worst. And so Dark Calories explains what are those things doing that makes processed food so deadly?

And it teaches us a new term. The term is oxidative stress. We have to understand this concept of oxidative stress in order to understand how processed foods are harmful and what happens to us and all the diseases that we will be fixing and how to do that.

But what are dark calories and how do they differ from the conventional understanding of calories? Right. So the dark calories is about the harms that the worst of the worst ingredients. I said there were four ultra processed ingredients. The worst of the worst are these refined vegetable seed oils.

There are a collection of eight of them, and those oils are corn, canola oil, which is also called rapeseed oil. It's the same thing. Cottonseed oil.

soy, sunflower, and safflower oils, as well as rice bran and grapeseed oil. So those eight are the hateful eight. And those are the worst of the worst. And I call them dark calories because in America, those eight oils are now adding up to 30% of the average American's total daily caloric intake.

and 80% of their fat calories. And yet medical science doesn't take this into account. Medical science doesn't even know the first thing about these oils. We don't really understand what they do to us. It's not part of our education.

So they're dark because they're invisible to medical science.

And they're dark because they're unhealthy. And they're dark because we need to shed some light on the truth here. And so that's what dark calories does. But can you just explain the role of processed foods and the industrial seed oils in contributing to dark calories too? Yeah, they are the worst of the worst. So the industrial seed oils, they put the junk in junk food. They are the defining feature of processed food.

You know, I realized that we needed to bring clarity to this conversation because I would ask my fellow health professionals, doctors, dietitians, "Why is junk food bad?" or "Why is processed food bad?" Right? And they wouldn't have a good answer. They would be all over the place. They would say things like, "Well, I think it's the salt," or, "Gee, I think it's the saturated fat," because, you know, we hear that they're full of saturated fat, but the

But the truth is there's very little saturated fat in them, because vegetable oils have very little saturated fat.

And other people would say it's the industrial contaminants, like the pesticides, the herbicides, or the heavy metals, stuff like this. So it's all over the place, and they haven't really defined it at all. So that's why I needed to bring the clarity that it's these hateful eight oils, and these are the worst things because...

They contain toxins when they come out of the factory. And then when we cook with them, and even when we just leave them on the shelf after opening the bottle, more toxins will form. And this comes from the process of oxidation. Oxidation is the source of the toxicity of most foods.

of the things that are toxic to us. And certainly of all four of the highly processed ingredients, they promote oxidation reactions. And oxidation is what ultimately

makes us sick and kills us. Oxidation is the root cause of disease and early death. And it's the opposite of biohacking, right? If you want to have a healthy life, oxidation is your absolute enemy. And like the first step is to get rid of oxidative stress, get rid of the oils that are promoting oxidative stress in your body through their toxicity.

There's multiple ways that they harm us. So we might need to talk about that. So that's good to ask a doctor, Kate. Since you're a doctor, why do you think biohackers have an important mission in our health world? Why are we needed? Well, I think that biohackers, I've asked myself that question, you know, and I'm like, so what are biohackers doing that's...

different than what like doctors are doing. And I think what they're doing is they're optimizing and they're asking different questions. They're not asking how to manage disease. They're asking something that I think is really important, which is why I wrote my first book, which is what is health? How can we be healthy? How do we know if we're healthy? What can we do if we're healthy? And I don't know how you define biohacking, but I've thought about it like this, like

What are we actually, you know, hacking originally in computers is like you're hacking into a system that they, whoever they are, don't want you in. Right. So you're hacking into a system. Well, there's an exact parallel with nutrition here, because with the with nutrition, you're hacking into the truth of what makes you healthy.

you're hacking into nature, I think. Like the answer to optimal health and longevity is to work with nature, not against it.

And that is something that, you know, they don't really want us to do that. They want us to, the processed food industry does not want us to be eating natural foods. They want us to be eating their products, which are all highly ultra-processed, refined, very bad for us, promoting oxidative stress, making us sick. And unfortunately, the sickness industry in America, a lot of it is very corrupt here because it's totally for-profit.

And the more a doctor does surgery, the more money they make, whether the surgery is necessary or not doesn't matter. And so this is a very disappointing thing that I learned about being a medical doctor in America. And so the healthcare system here is, since it's for profit, there's a lot of incentive to just make people as sick as possible.

Or I should say there's no incentive to keep people healthy, right? Like in countries where you have socialized medicine, the government will go bankrupt if everybody's sick. So I have this idea, maybe I'm wrong, that it's a little less corrupt in countries where you have more socialized medicine.

But it's terrifically corrupt here. And so they being the sick care industry, right? Like, you know, the healthcare industry is what it's supposed to be, but it's so bad that people, a lot of people just call it the sick care industry. The sick care industry does not want you to know about oxidative stress. They do not want you to know how to use nature's power to help your body get healthy.

And the thing that they use, there's one big lie that they use to keep doctors from learning this. And that lie is about cholesterol. What does cholesterol do? They don't want us to know the truth. Let's talk about that.

Great. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Let's go into it. How this goes back to the vegetable oils and yeah. How you see this is really great. Yeah. So the idea that cholesterol is bad is a lie. And in

In the book Dark Calories, I tell the origin story of this lie, which is really the story of the biggest scandal ever perpetrated on the American public by a medical organization, because it's a scandal that has affected every American and everyone that has an American-like system in that they

Their cardiologists believe cholesterol causes heart attacks, which is pretty much every country in the world. So this scandal has affected everyone. And it happened 70 years ago. And the scandal is that the American Heart Association took money from a company called Procter & Gamble.

Now, Procter & Gamble sold vegetable oils like soy oil and cottonseed oils. And after the American Heart Association took their money, the doctors at the American Heart Association did something completely unethical. They started promoting vegetable oils like soy and cottonseed as a way to prevent heart attacks.

They had just gotten money from this company. Now suddenly they're promoting them. That claim was completely unfounded when they started making it in the late 50s and early 60s. No evidence whatsoever. So that was a complete lie. It was outright lie. But it gets worse from there.

because it became more powerful. The lie became more powerful and more complex, because what they did, the American Heart Association then spent the next few decades fabricating a huge pile of evidence to support the heart-healthy claim, like scientific evidence in scare quotes. But the truth is that

They had the agenda. The point was not to discover the cause of heart attacks. The point was to prove that these oils were better than saturated fat rich foods like butter, eggs, cheese, meats, and so on.

So, you know, the truth is these oils are not heart healthy. And in fact, quite a number of scientists say that vegetable oils and the hayflate actually can promote heart attacks. So that's the scandal. That's the lie. That's the problem. And that's how they keep us alive.

afraid of using nature's power. Are there any changes? Are there any optimistic views on your book, on your theories now? Do you see any change at all? Are you hopeful? Yes, I'm actually hopeful. And in the book, I have an entire chapter called Reasons for Hope. And in that chapter, I talk about how doctors who are

have lost that fear of cholesterol. They've educated themselves. They've hacked in a little bit into the power of nature. And they started recommending things like butter and eggs and meat to their patients.

And they've seen dramatic health turnarounds, just unbelievable. And there's books now that are coming out about these health turnarounds that you can reverse Alzheimer's, you can reverse bipolar disorder, depression, serious mental disorders, schizophrenia. You can get people off drugs. You can reverse type 2 diabetes. And you can probably even prevent cancer.

Now, the thing that is still not quite there yet, which is why I still have hope and it's not already like mission accomplished yet. We still have a little work to do because right now those doctors are keto doctors. They identify as low carb or keto doctors. And they also tell people to avoid seed oils, but they don't understand that avoiding seed oils is the most powerful thing.

that their patients need to do. And it should be emphasized to do that 100% and worry a little bit less about every last scrap of carbohydrate out there because you can follow a keto diet and have ketones in your bloodstream, but you will still get unhealthy if you're using vegetable oil. So it's not about...

Truly, I don't think that metabolic health is about ketones. I think it's about not poisoning yourself with vegetable oils and getting a healthy, balanced human diet. Your diet has to be free of the four processed ingredients, has to be free of those because they promote oxidative stress. And your diet has to be full of the kinds of nutrients that help your body control oxidative stress.

We can't ever eliminate oxidative stress because we have to breathe oxygen, and oxygen will always cause some oxidative stress. But a healthy diet helps our body with antioxidants. It helps our body fight against oxidative stress. It helps our body control the energy in oxygen, and that's really what's going on here.

Oxygen's energy keeps us alive, right? Oxygen's energy is what our little mitochondria use to generate ATP energy for our cells. It's oxygen that the mitochondria control. And oxygen breaks the bonds in carbohydrates and fats and proteins and our fuels, right?

And the mitochondria convert those broken bond energy into ATP. So it's an amazing cooperative system that's going on inside our cells between the mitochondria, antioxidants, and every aspect of our metabolism in our cell.

But it all gets disrupted because the seed oils promote so much oxidative stress that mitochondria can no longer control oxygen energy. And that changes everything about how our metabolism works. And that's where I go into...

the energy model of insulin resistance, because that helps us understand the real role of sugar and making us sick and really why it's a secondary factor. It still makes us sick. It's still not healthy, but vegetable oils are worse for us. It's simple. You know, it's helpful to know which is worse because it's hard to avoid everything all at once. Um, and, um,

The other thing is that when your metabolism isn't working, right, you're physically addicted to sugar. So it's difficult for a lot of people to hear that they can't have any sugar. And so in my plan, I pull people back on sugar just as far as they need to go and no farther, right? So they still have some carbohydrates in their body, but not too much that they get toxicity from it.

So that's my solution. But say for the listeners or for an average person who eats an average diet,

and you had a lot of PUFAs, you had a lot of vegetable oils in your body for a long time, and you would make a change. Of course, the easiest thing is to just stop eating vegetable oils, but how would the diet be beneficial for you after when you start this detoxification period? What should you eat? Yeah, you should eat normal food. So what is normal food? So that's an important question too, because we've forgotten, right? We're so worried about cholesterol and saturated fat that we don't think that a hamburger is healthy, but it is.

We don't realize that eggs are healthy and butter is healthy and cheese is healthy, but they are. Right. And so we've so, so blamed sugar that we have people afraid of even whole grains like wheat berries that you can sprout and that are extremely nutritious. So I teach people in the last third of the book that,

what real food actually is. And I help people reconnect to their real food roots, right? I give them the principles that they need to know in order to build healthy meals from scratch. Because that's really what is the fastest way to recovery is to not rely on like processed foods, even protein powders, you know, but just get regular food from the grocery store and learn how to

assemble it together without even cooking it most of the time for breakfast or lunch. You don't even have to cook. Why not just have peanut butter on celery with a glass of milk? So just normal food like that. You could have a sandwich. You could have sandwich meat, deli meat is what we call it here. It's like slices of roast turkey that you put on a sandwich with cheese.

But I teach you how to find the healthiest brands of those because some people, you could say that sandwich meat is processed food, right? It is minimally processed because it's kind of ready to eat. You know, it's already cooked. You don't have to cook it yourself. That makes it convenient. It doesn't make it unhealthy because it's still actual food. It's a hunk of meat.

And there's a little bit of preservatives in there called nitrates and nitrites. And when you know to use the healthy kind of nitrates, then you're fine. And I teach people how to find those too.

So those are just a few examples of like what you're going to do. You're going to build breakfast, lunch, dinner out of real food that you made yourself from scratch. And I have recipes that are so easy. You can get a dinner put together sometimes in like a minute and a half. Not a dinner, breakfast and lunch put together. Dinner, usually you want to cook something. It's going to take a little longer.

It's a really great chapter and everyone that reads the book will go into this and understand exactly how to do this. It's really great and so straightforward. But Dr. Kate, we have to talk about the craze around Osempic, the drug. Because I've heard you talk about it and we are wondering because...

We see these people, it's a big thing in Norway as well, that they take this drug and they really lose weight, but they don't do anything with their food intake. And what's happening then? Right. So what's happening is not good if you continue to eat vegetable oils and other processed ingredients, because what's happening is that you're not fixing the reason you gained weight.

Ozempic is merely an appetite suppressant. It doesn't burn fat for you. It's not a miracle drug. It just suppresses your appetite. Now, you won't need it if you follow the plan in the Fat Burn Fix. You won't need to suppress your appetite with drugs because what real food does when you include healthy fat, healthy cholesterol, real protein, what that does is it keeps your energy levels up.

from between breakfast and lunch, your energy stays high. Then you have another healthy lunch. Well, your lunch was so healthy, it's got healthy fats in there. It's got some healthy carbohydrates, some healthy proteins. Those are going to sustain your energy till dinner. It's only when your energy levels drop that you get what we call here hangry. Do you have that term? You know what that is? Yes.

Yeah, you get hungry, but it's not normal hunger. You get angry and irritable. You get brain fog. You get shaky. That's when your energy levels drop. And your energy levels are dropping because of the metabolic damage that you need to recover from. And Ozempic just suppresses the hunger, but it doesn't fix the energy problem. So what happens is that your body goes into panic mode.

It releases adrenaline and cortisol that raise your blood sugar again so that you have energy and you don't feel, again, you're not feeling hungry. But you're getting your energy is not coming from your body fat so much. And this is the problem. They're discovering already going to discover, discovering this here, that this is a problem because you're,

your panicking stress hormones are raising your blood sugar by breaking down your muscle, breaking down your bones for the protein in them to get protein into the mitochondria for energy. And why? Why do they have to do that? Why won't they just use your body fat? Well, that's the whole problem with polyunsaturates because our mitochondria can't use them for energy.

And when there's so many in our diet, we have too many polyunsaturates in our body fat. And then too many polyunsaturates get released that when they enter the mitochondria, they start to poison the mitochondria because oxygen and polyunsaturates produces toxicity.

You see, so it's a little bit of an indirect route. You have to understand how the body works as a cooperative organism, right? It's not just about sugar. It's not just about insulin. It's not just about one thing. It's about how these polyunsaturates change our body fat. Then that means that changes what our mitochondria get to burn between meals, right?

And that means that between meals, they can't get energy from your body fat and it's going to use your blood sugar up. It's going to use up that little bit of blood sugar. It's going to make your blood sugar drop. And that's why you feel like your blood sugar is dropping because it's dropping.

and that's why you feel so desperately hypoglycemic and desperately hungry and hangry and irritable that's why your brain doesn't work right this used to happen to me before i changed my diet i would get like brain fog after i came home from work when my blood sugar was at the lowest

and I wouldn't be able to remember what happened during the day. And I didn't know that that was from my metabolism. I thought that was just I was dumb or stupid or something, a bad wife, because I couldn't have a normal conversation with my husband. And so that is all of that hunger and hanger is being suppressed by the ozempic

But you still have this problem where your mitochondria aren't wanting to burn your body fat. And if you don't have any carbohydrates coming in from your diet, which you don't because it's between meals, then that fuel has to come from...

our body stores, which are limited. And that means ultimately we start breaking down our own tissues. And so this is why we've seen some really scary body composition changes in people taking Ozempic and losing weight. To give you an example, when you lose weight, it's thought that you always do lose a certain portion from your body fat and a small portion from your muscle. And the thinking has always been, well,

You're losing weight now. So when you walk around, you're carrying less. That means your muscles don't have to work so hard. So it makes some sense, right? So let's say you lose 20 pounds. Typically, five pounds would come from muscle or bone or something. And 15 pounds would come from your body fat. Now, what's happening with Ozempic is it's way more

coming from lean mass, coming from your muscle, and way less coming from your body fat. So we're going to find that when people get off the Ozempic, they're weaker, and now their body has less muscle, and the weight that's going to come back on is not going to necessarily be muscle and bone anymore. It's going to be more fat. So I think we're going to see really serious metabolic problems happening from

longer term studies of how Ozempic is affecting us. I'm talking about like two, three years, you know, when people use it once, then they regain the weight after they regain the weight, then they reuse it again. I think we're going to see some serious, serious consequences. And I don't think that it's going to be good. You know, I mean, I don't even know if it's how people are going to hear about it because, you know, Ozempic is so powerful and

it does not require, like it should require that body composition is done, but it's just weight.

So people are just looking at the weight and the weight loss. They don't know they're losing maybe bone density. So if you had a client coming into your office who wanted to go off of Sampic, what would you guide or suggest for that person in order to have less burden on the metabolic health? Yeah. So the good news is that the same diet that's good for one person

Problem is pretty much good for all problems. So it's the same, but so yeah, I would make the same recommendations. Um, and, uh, I would, uh,

You know, also talk maybe a little bit about starting some exercise or activity. But if, you know, I get that point. Doing exercise is also good for your bone and your muscle. And, you know, everybody on Ozempic should be staying a little bit active. But then again, everybody on Ozempic really needs exercise.

to avoid vegetable oils because I think that's what's making this problem worse. You know, if somebody was on Ozempic and they wanted to stay on Ozempic, I would tell them you absolutely need to avoid vegetable oils.

And I would think that they could get off of Ozempic very easily by starting this kind of a diet because it is only an appetite suppressant. And so when they learn how to make healthy meals that will naturally suppress their appetite, they will be able to, they don't need an appetite suppressant anymore, right? Or maybe they need a very, very low dose of it.

or just only need it once in a while when they're going to some tempting place, a wedding or something like that, traveling. So hopefully all doctors read this book so they can do this, give these recommendations to their patients, because this is going to be a big problem, really a big problem, I think. But Dr. Kate, you talked about hypoglycemia. Can you just explain what that is for our listeners?

- So hypoglycemia is a medical term for low blood sugar. And so our blood sugar in our bloodstream is very, there's very small amount in there. And just using a little bit extra can start to use up too much and the blood sugar level starts to drop. Now, when we are not healthy,

our brain needs that sugar for energy because our brain is not getting much in the way of ketones when we're not healthy. Our brain is no alternative fuel. In other words, our brain really needs that blood sugar. Our brain uses up more sugar than any other organ in the body. The brain is more active. It burns more calories at rest than any other organ in the body except the heart. So

We feel our blood sugar falling in our brain. And that's why we get these symptoms of brain fog. That's why it affects our moods. We get angry, hangry, irritable. We can't concentrate. And first and foremost, most people get insanely hungry and they start obsessing about food. They have intrusive food thoughts. They get what's called food noise. And that comes from hypoglycemia.

We have a term here. A lot of people using Ozempic say that it quiets their food noise. And that's because they don't feel that energy drop from hypoglycemia anymore because their appetite system is just being blasted with this drug. And they don't feel that anymore. They don't feel that the effects of the blood sugar dropping the way they used to anymore.

So hypoglycemia is a very, very important indicator that your body fat is full of too much PUFA for your mitochondria to use for energy and that you have insulin resistance and your metabolism isn't working right.

It's an indicator that you're going to feel amazing once you get off the vegetable oils and start learning how to build healthy meals. That's very good. If we talk about the brain again, because you say that the brain is using the most sugar, can the brain work in another direction? Because when it hits the liver, the sugar hits the liver, it tells the liver that you need more and produce more sugar from scratch again. Yeah, so the brain is the reason that people become...

pre-diabetic because the brain is the one saying, hey, guys, there's not enough sugar here for me between meals. I want you, Mr. Liver, down there to release more sugar for me. Please do this. And the liver can do it. The liver stores some glycogen, which is just a starch, and it breaks down the glycogen and that's sugar.

And the liver also does another process called gluconeogenesis. And that's where we get into the danger zone because gluconeogenesis makes glucose from proteins. And we don't have storage proteins. We only have muscle, bone, you know, body parts made out of protein. And this is not a process that we are supposed to do very often. It's a process we only do under stress conditions.

from the release of stress hormones, adrenaline and cortisol. And this is where the brain comes in because the brain, when blood sugar starts dropping, the brain's energy drops and the brain panics. That is a stress because the brain will die in just a matter of seconds. If it doesn't have enough energy, the cells will start to die. We don't want little cells, not the whole brain, just little, the cells that are stressed. And so, and,

To prevent that from happening, the brain sends a signal through the vagus nerve that connects the brain to the adrenal glands and to the liver. And it says, that signal says, release stress hormones and raise that blood sugar again. So the brain is trying to get the blood sugar level up.

higher than normal. And that is the crazy part here. So we have people, this is what I've just described what's going on in anybody who has insulin resistance. When you're insulin resistant, your brain wants you to have more sugar in the system all the time. But that's a problem because your pancreas knows that

blood sugar levels need to be lower than what the brain is now asking for. So your pancreas produces a hormone called insulin, and that insulin starts storing, starts putting sugar into fat, lowering the blood sugar again. So what does the brain do?

It has to release more stress hormones. And so this is a battle. And one of your organs is caught in the middle of this battle. And that is the liver. Because the liver is getting information from insulin. The insulin tells the liver, stop doing gluconeogenesis. Stop putting sugar in the bloodstream. That's what insulin says. But meanwhile, the vagus nerve from the brain says,

tells the liver, "More sugar, more gluconeogenesis, put more sugar in the bloodstream." So what happens? The liver has to make a choice and it makes a choice to ignore insulin.

So we know that that is the beginning of insulin resistance. I've just described the energy model of insulin resistance, and this is new information. This is not something that other people have been talking about because it's my idea that I've worked several years to kind of piece it together.

So it's very high level science. If you're a little bit confused, that's because it's eluded doctors. It's eluded scientists studying this. Nobody has put it together like this.

And so that's why I had to put it in a book so that people could look at it and study it and really understand it because this is what I think is going on. It explains what we see in the world better than any other theory of insulin resistance. And I think it's important to look at it this way so we know the best action to take

is not to focus on sugar and carbohydrates so much exclusively, which is what's mostly been done, right? It's to focus on getting healthy fats and getting energy between meals. And if some energy is going to come from healthy fats, some might come from whole food proteins, and some might come from

very healthy carbohydrate containing foods. We know vegetables like broccoli and Brussels sprouts have some carbohydrates. So those are very good kinds of carbohydrates because they don't spike insulin. They don't cause any kind of insulin problems. They just give your brain a little bit of sugar. So it doesn't have to tell the liver to make sugar from your muscles.

I'm trying to prevent this kind of problem from happening because we see that this is what causes skinny fat. No one's been able to explain skinny fat. And that's the same model. It's the same process.

It's the same process, exactly. Because skinny fat happens in people who are insulin resistant. And the more insulin resistant you are, the more you've become more fat than muscle. And you can even be a normal weight and be skinny fat. So that's what the term is all about. You're not fat, but you have a high percentage of body fat, such a high percentage that you could even be considered obese.

Because you're lacking in muscle and you're also lacking in bone density. And this is terrible. This is not a setup for health. We have teenagers who are at their peak bone density, you know, entering their peak bone density, who are breaking down their muscle and their bone. And they will never have

strong bones because of this happening. And we have teen, that's teenage girls and boys, especially girls though. And then we have teenage boys who are not able to build muscle and not able to bulk up because of this same process, the same process. It's more subtle, but it's the same process. That's why we see young men who have very thin bones. Like they have kind of a long skinny necks, right? They look a little bit frail. They don't look tough. Like, uh,

you know, their fathers and right. And their grandfathers, I've, I've seen this change happen over generations that I've been in medicine and it's, it's a big problem and no other, like there's no other explanation that puts it all together that I know of.

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So, to the results of the skin scan. We can say that we are reasonably satisfied, Monika. When it came to wrinkles around the eyes, 6% fewer wrinkles were measured after these 12 weeks, and 10% improvement was found after the skin was tightened.

I also had a big increase in elasticity and tension in my skin, with almost 20%. When it came to wrinkles, I had the same as Monica, maybe a little less, maybe just 5%. We are very pleased. MyBrit also said that it can take time to get results, and we agreed that a new scan after the summer is very smart, so we are waiting 12 new weeks before the next scan.

Go to osloskinlab.no.

So when you wrote this energy model of insulin resistance, what did you base the theories on? I suppose, or we suppose it's your own practice and meeting with clients all these years, a lot of science. Yeah, it's a lot of science and trying to understand. I just really, I asked this question, what does having this weird body fat do?

And so I asked a simple question. I mean, first I discovered in around about 2012 or 13 that because our diets were so heavy in vegetable oil, this has reformulated our body fat so that instead of being just like 5% polyunsaturates, it's more like 10, 20, 30%. And I asked myself, that can't be good.

because I know that these polyunsaturates react with oxygen. And I know that mitochondria, we all know this is not disputed, that mitochondria have

have a lot of oxygen in there and that mitochondria plus polyunsaturates inside could be a really big problem. And there's a lot of science behind that. That is what happens during the process of apoptosis. There's a reaction called the Fenton reaction. This is undisputed biochemistry. So it's not like it's just a theory. I'm connecting these different and separate observations

And so I asked, do we have any evidence that burning polyunsaturates, what does it do to mitochondria? What does it do? Does it do anything bad? And for years, I looked to find a study.

And it took me years to find one. And I did finally find one. And that study is in the book, Dark Calories. And it shows in a graph that you can feed saturated fat, monounsaturated fat, and polyunsaturated fat into mitochondria and is definitely drastically different results in terms of that mitochondria's ability to produce energy.

within a matter of minutes, the polyunsaturates start shutting down the energy production and you keep going and the cell dies. Whereas with saturated fat and monounsaturated fat, which is what human body fat is supposed to mostly contain,

Those are extraordinarily great fuels, and you keep running the cell at 100% energy production levels. Wow. This is so great, Dr. Kate. You explain really well. It's so good to have you here. But in your book, you talk about avoiding, how we can prevent diseases, what I'm going for here. Avoiding the vegetable oil can make us sicker.

cancer-proof. How is this possible? I think it can. I think it can. Now, this is another amazing scientific discovery that a lot of doctors know nothing about.

So I have to introduce a man to you whose name is Thomas Seyfried. He is like, I don't know, must be almost 80. He has been doing cutting-edge cancer research for something like 40, 50 years now. And what he has shown, and as much as anything can be proven in science, he has proven that cancer is...

coming from mitochondrial damage. It's not coming from DNA damage. What happens is that when mitochondria are damaged, they release free radicals that damage DNA. So that's why we find damaged DNA. But the first thing is the mitochondria are damaged. And so what does that, how does that translate to vegetables? Vegetable oils have to do with that?

Well, I just said vegetable oils damage mitochondria. And Dr. Seyfried has shown us over and over again in so many ways that if you have healthy mitochondria, you can't get cancer. Simple as that. And I just said that if you eat vegetable oils, you can't have healthy mitochondria.

if you eat too much vegetable oil, right? So you put those two and two together, you take away vegetable oils, and you can practically make yourself cancer-proof, right? You still have to have an otherwise healthy diet, of course. I wouldn't recommend smoking, don't do lots of alcohol. But if you take away vegetable oils, you can do all the other right things. This is the missing piece from our war on cancer in this world. Because we have been fighting the wrong battle. We've been fighting DNA.

and DNA mutations, and we've turned a complete blind eye to the role of vegetable oils in harming our mitochondria. And guess what? Damaged mitochondria. Now we know that's what causes cancer.

So it's a huge, extraordinary, like, leap forward in our ability to prevent cancer. You know what? This even applies to genetic cancers. Have you heard about, you know, like there's genes for cancer, like the breast cancer gene? Do you know that those genes all affect the mitochondria?

So again, it points back to if you can keep your mitochondria healthy, maybe even with those genes, you won't get cancer because none of those cancer genes are 100%. So that means if you have the genes, boy, that's bad news. You're at very high risk, but it's not 100%. It's not 100% death sentence. And so if you avoid seed oils and control oxidative stress and follow a healthy diet, I think you can take that 20% chance of death.

and dial it all the way up to 90 or maybe 100% chance of avoiding cancer. Well, that's great to hear. But if we go back to the standard life most of us live, we grab some food on the go. We probably go to buy some French fries that are cooked in oils and

Yeah, tell us about the five-ounce serving of French fries cooked in vegetable oils. What does that do to us? Yeah, so a toxicologist from England, he did a study on how much of a certain family of toxin you're eating when you eat a five-ounce serving of French fries. And according to his math, it's the same amount as you would get from smoking a pack of cigarettes twice.

And so we have about 25, 20 to 25 fries in five ounces. Uh, that is a one-to-one one fry equals one cigarette. So it's like, if you, if you are a French fry eater, you have a smoking habit. You just didn't even know it. Um,

And these are even worse because these, along with those toxins, you get a lot of polyunsaturated fatty acids too, that the toxins attack those and you have more toxins now. So because they're like catalysts, it's like a chain reaction that happens from having these toxins go around polyunsaturates in oxygen, right? So with those, we have oxygen plus polyunsaturates.

polyunsaturates is bad news. Over and over again, we keep finding evidence for that. The regular person, you want to grab those fries, you're hungry. Don't get hungry. Okay, that's the key. So that sounds impossible, right? But no, it's actually not. Because once you learn how to build

a meal that has energizing ingredients in it, you're gonna not be hungry for so much longer than normal for you, right? Let's say you get, you know, normally you have a breakfast, whatever, like maybe oatmeal or a banana and some fat-free yogurt.

you have a healthier breakfast, instead of getting hungry and wanting some kind of snack at around 10 or two hours later, you're going to make it all the way to lunch. And you're not going to be so hungry and hangry at lunch that you make a bad choice. Now you don't feel like you have to have a soda and fries. Maybe you can just get the healthy part, just the sandwich, you know? So it's a positive feedback cycle where one good choice leads to another, makes another good choice easier, right? And then of course I teach you, I have a

several recipes, quite a few recipes so that for one week, you will take two weeks, you will take a challenge to avoid seed oils, get them all out of your kitchen and learn how to make some really easy meals from healthy foods from scratch. And I have some recipes for these things that are so easy. They're not even there's no cooking, right? It's just like how to make a, you know, avocado toast. Like that's not hard.

right so and how to have like the the original fast foods were things like a slice of cheddar cheese what kind of cheese do you guys um like what's the favorite cheese there up in um your country we love goat cheese but we also have from cow here so yeah

We have good cheese. We have really good cheese. That is delicious. And you could, why not just have that as a meal, maybe with some nuts, maybe a tiny little, some berries or something like that. If you want something, a little bit of fiber, a little bit of sweet, maybe some carrot sticks instead, you know, like I have such simple, simple ideas like that, that that's where you can start. That will get you started. You'll start feeling better. Then you'll find more

easy, fast recipes. Food is also about addictions or an emotional state you're in when you eat. But I was just thinking about the cigarettes and the fried fries. What is the half-life after in your body if you compare those two components? So those toxins, they don't stay in the body per se. They're very reactive. That's why they're so hazardous.

So the liver sometimes can eliminate them or as part of their toxicity, they're chemicals. So they chemically bind your cells molecules. And then that turns like, say they bind a protein enzyme, they will just bond onto it. Now that protein is damaged. It's no use anymore in the body.

So the cell has a little garbage disposal system that will break down that damaged protein, you see. So the cell has its own detoxification systems. And that happens quite quickly.

The thing that stays in your body for a long time is the reformulated body fat with all that PUFA in there, with all the polyunsaturated in there. That stays in there for years. But it's okay because you're going to be improving your health way before it's all gone.

You're going to see. You're going to feel better. You're going to see if you have high triglycerides, you're going to see that coming down. If you have high blood sugar, you're going to see that coming down. If you have high blood pressure, you'll see that coming down. If you have kidney problems, liver problems, improvements. All these good things happen. Your brain will start working better. If you even have mild cognitive decline, you start to have cognitive improvements, right?

right? Oh, so many amazing things happen. If you have bipolar disorder, people start getting significantly better. They get off meds in like months. You know, that's way before these things are out of your body fat. So you'll start, what it means is you're going to feel better right away, but you're going to continue to feel better for years. And in the end of this process, you will not even recognize yourself. And

And your relationship with food will be different and healthy finally. Right. I mean, I can't guarantee that, but it's happened to me and it's happened to so many people who've read the books and wrote me letters. And they're just like, I used to be a hopeless chocoholic or hopelessly addicted to donuts or like me, hopelessly addicted to mocha frappuccinos from Starbucks.

You know, and they've experienced these transformational relationship changes with food because our brain is always changing, right? We built an unhealthy relationship. It's just structures in our brain. We can disassemble those structures and rebuild healthy ones. Of course, it takes time, but it's important to know that it can happen and expect it. So that's why I tell people what to expect.

It will happen. Yes, yes, yes, yes. But last time you were on the podcast, we didn't get a chance to talk to you about the LA Lakers. And...

the nutrition program that you did with legendary Gary Vitti. So can we talk about that now? And what kind of advice do you have for athletes and what happened there? How did you get started with the LA Lakers? Yeah. So what happened was, um, uh, my husband, uh, sent a call up Gary Vitti and, and just said, um,

I think there are some things that you could be doing that would really give you an edge on the competition with your diet. Would you read my wife's book?

My husband said, she's really smart. You know, he talked me up good. And he said, yeah, sure. And, you know, we were all thrilled that he was even going to read it. But you know what? He's like so much integrity. He's like read everybody's books. He would actually read them. But what he told us was that our book was the first that he actually ever wanted to take advantage of and, you know, to use forever.

to change radically overhaul their diet. And so what we did, the hardest thing was getting out the vegetable oils because they're in everything. They're everywhere. That was very hard, but we also, um, got them healthy meats. You know, we got them grass fed everything. And, um,

healthier chicken, pastured chicken, focusing more on vegetables. And we had to, it was very much a struggle, but we, constant struggle, but we had to keep the candy and the sugar away from them because, you know, all the dieticians are always telling them Gatorade has sugar, so it's, you know, going to give you energy. And that to them means candy has sugar, so it's good for you, right? Because the dieticians are miseducated.

And so that was a big, big battle. But the main thing was taking away the unhealthy oils

and, uh, just that alone. And even, even letting them still have, you know, some quality cookies for dessert or that had butter in them instead of crappy cookies. Um, and, you know, sweet tasting fruits and the occasional chocolate and stuff like that. Um, then the amazing recoveries, like just amazing things happen. Cause you know, they always get injured, right? It's,

basketball is a dangerous sport. They're bumping into each other. They're pushing each other. They're trying to trip each other. So they always get injured. And just one quick example, Kobe was jumping up real high for a basket. And this one guy from the other team put his foot underneath where he knew Kobe would land. So he rolled his foot and sprained his ankle huge. He was out of the game. It's that

That kind of thing is they get away with it. It's a dirty game. And so he was out with a big swollen ankle. He was so depressed. He was like, this is the second worst sprain I ever had. And they were telling him he was going to be out for at least six weeks.

But what did we do? So we had an answer for that. We gave him Nature's Anti-Inflammatory, which is a bone broth. He was already off the seed oils because he was very interested in this new strategy. And so we gave him bone broth soup that we had. I called up the chef. I had called up the chef at the hotel yesterday.

and got them to make sure they had some of this on hand because they knew some of the guys would want it. And so we gave him two bowls and we kept telling Kobe every single day, have two bowls. And instead of being out six weeks, he was out for 12 days and then he was playing again. Amazing. That's wonderful to hear that you share these stories because I think we can learn so much from bits and pieces from all what you're teaching. And this brings up over to families and parents because I think we can transfer a lot of what you just said.

according to athletes. But what are the common mistakes parents make in terms of their children's healthy diet? Yeah, the hardest thing is to...

I guess food-wise, some of the common things is people think that those little crackers that taste like cheese, do you have those over there? We call them goldfish here. Yes, we do. Okay. Yeah, they think those are healthy because they claim to be made with natural cheddar cheese. But they have a lot of seed oils in there. And the cereals that are highly processed, that are just very processed grains...

Granola will have seed oil too, but things like the Cheerios and the flakes and stuff like that, those are the highly refined grains and they're very low nutrition, almost no nutrition, also promote oxidative stress. A little different reason than the seed oils do, but they still cause the metabolic problems. So the cereals, the oatmeal, instant oatmeal,

A lot of the snack wells, like the sandwiches that, you know, they are crackers in there and you put, there's like a little spreadable cheese or some kind of peanut butter or something like that. And the kids at school put this on these crackers. Those crackers have the seed oils. The peanut butter has the seed oils. The cheese is not real cheese. So it's just a load of garbagey food. And so those kinds of things, you know,

please do away with those. And instead, just give them, you know, a regular peanut butter and jelly sandwich. Right? I mean, jelly is not the end of the world. Just use a little jelly and use a quality peanut butter that doesn't have, use a natural peanut butter that doesn't have, you know, any of the hateful eight in there. Or sugar, right? Sugar. Do you know that peanut butter with sugar, one third of that jar is sugar?

No, we didn't know. We don't buy it. Yeah, so just use a quality peanut butter, a quality bread, and, you know, a quality jelly and put some milk in there. Hopefully your child isn't lactose intolerant.

But that's a great breakfast. I had that for years. I made it myself in high school. And yeah, so don't let the school feed your child, at least in this country. I don't know what the rules are there, but in this country, for the schools to get government funding, they must use the seed oils. They're only allowed to have a very small amount of saturated fat, unless you use vegetable oil and everything.

then children are only getting fat from the vegetable oils practically, and they're not getting any healthy fats. And that's going to make them extremely hungry and hangry and irritable, and they're going to need snacks. And it's just going to set them on a path for weight gain and unhealthy relationships with food. Because when we are children and we are hungry and have low energy and we get something sweet and it makes us feel better,

That is the beginning of an unhealthy relationship with food and a very devastating addiction, kind of addiction to sugar. Because we're needing sugar for energy there. It's using sugar for energy makes it more addicting. It's very addicting already just for the taste. You know, 200 years ago, we still had people with a sweet tooth.

But now almost everybody has a sweet tooth because our brains have learned that sugar gives it energy. So all of our taste buds, all of our cravings are arranged around getting something sweet or starchy that will raise our blood sugar and give our brain that energy.

because it's getting wires crossed about nutrition. Our brain is supposed to sense nutrition more than energy. But these days, it's sensing mostly energy. And that's why people need Ozempic, because their energy levels are always low. And the satiety hormones cannot work in that system, in that setting.

They're always going on. The satiety never works. And the hunger from lack of energy is insane. And that's what develops these from childhood.

these sugar cravings and these bad relationships with food. And you have no chance of resolving it while your brain still thinks sugar is energy. And that's why you have to untrain that. And that's what dark calories does is it retrains your brain that you are okay getting energy from fat and getting energy without eating sweet foods.

And that totally changes your relationship with food. So we are truly grateful for having this conversation because this is the only way to raise awareness and share the message. And especially now when you have your new book, Dark Calories, Kate, that's wonderful. And thank you so much for all your knowledge. Are you doing any tours? Are you speaking somewhere? Do you have more content for people to reach out? Of course, they're going to get the book here in Norway too.

Yes, I definitely get the book. So what I'm doing next is I'm working on a project where I can help people become...

much more organized in their approach to meal planning. Like I take away the hassle of being healthy. It's a program where you're going to learn how to make shopping be your meal planning so that once you've gone shopping for the week, you're already all set. Right.

You know what you're going to do. You don't have to do spend a day cooking everything to do that kind of meal planning. It's not that kind of it's a brand new kind of meal planning. That's just so much more on the go. It's just it trains you what to do. You sort of become like, you know, those cooking shows where they have challenges about, OK, you've got this food in your fridge now make a meal. Right. Yeah. It kind of almost trains you how to do that.

Like you can be your own top chef with the ingredients that you buy. So you always know what to do with them. So that's wonderful. We have the science, we have you, we have the book, and now we even get the tools, how to make it. It's wonderful. Yeah, this is so wonderful. But,

But Dr. Kate, last time you were on our podcast, that's actually our most popular podcast ever. And we have lots of episodes. This is really, we're feeling that we are doing a great job here in Norway, educating people with your help. But how do you see the future? You have done this for so many years and the awareness around these oils. How do you see the future?

Are we going to see more companies using more saturated fats again? I think we will. Yeah, I think that, you know, that's it tastes better. So the real chefs are never going to let that die. But I think that the real turning point is going to come when doctors learn about this. And I think doctors do want this information. They just don't know that they're missing it.

And I say this from experience because I know as a doctor myself early in my practice, I didn't think I was really making a difference just refilling drugs to treat people's blood pressure problems and, you know, refilling drugs for cholesterol, refilling drugs for their heart failure, their diabetes, it just

that did not feel like I was making a difference. And I know there must be other doctors that feel that way and that will have so much more meaning in their career when they learn that, yes, you can actually make people healthy and they'll come back and they'll be grateful to you. They'll love you. And then it's just such a good feeling because that's why I went into medicine to actually heal people.

I just didn't learn how to do it. But Dark Calories gives doctors and dieticians and nurses the answer on how to actually heal their patients. So I really hope that, you know, if you're not a doctor, maybe give it to your doctor. Definitely. On his birthday or doctor's day. And tell them, you know, how much it helps you feel better.

And then it's written by a doctor too. So that maybe that'll help. It will help a lot. Okay. Thank you very much for your time. We are really grateful again, Kate. Well, thank you, Monica and Alette. This has been a pleasure again. And I like that we have coordinated outfits.

yes we are all in red in red orange so okay be safe and all the best to you with your tour on the book now good luck thank you

Thank you. Thank you very much. And yeah, I can't wait to see how your audience responds to this. And if you need help with questions, feel free to reach out. Thank you. We will do that. We had a lot of questions on the last round, so we will definitely send you the questions from them. Okay. Great. Bye-bye. Thank you very much. Bye. Bye.

When we sit in a podcast studio and talk to guests from the USA who speak a different language, we are not Americans, even though we like and believe that we do, we have to really concentrate and we can't always remember everything that is said in the episode. We talk in this roundabout way, the ending takes us right to the point after we have had the guest on, but we will try as well as we can to get some of the highlights that we have.

Dr. Kate Chen has shared with us today. She is just absolutely fantastic. And we are back with a new addition. Because she is now entering this with dark calories. It is actually a completely new thought. It has not been up in the whole thing. And the approach and that she can. She is a physician for a doctor who is now...

is on a mission. Now it's doctors who are going to be enlightened, and we have to help them. We all have to give our doctor a copy of this book, at least tell what Dr. Kate is talking about. Yes, and you may also notice that she has always come back to this oxidative stress and mitochondria, and that all diseases are about mitochondrial health, because if they work well,

then you won't get that sick. And if you have too much PUFAS, or Polyunsaturated Fats, in the mitochondrial cells, then they won't be able to optimize the energy and use of the mitochondria, and it will feel like poison to the body. So that was back to the whole time. All the time, and it was very interesting when we talked about this with Kreft, and she mentioned Thomas Seyfried, he has also been in Norway,

And how this with mitochondria, of course, plays into it. She said it so easily. If you have healthy mitochondria, you can't get cancer. The name Thomas Seyfried. And if you have bad mitochondria, you get that from vegetables and other things. It was a bit flippant, maybe. And then she put those two theories together for her own message. But listen now, you who are listening to the podcast, or if you know someone who uses Osempeik,

It has become a huge trend wave and much more scary than since we started and had our own episode called the slanky spray. Go back and listen to it. But if you know someone who uses Sampic or you do it yourself, then listen carefully. You can't eat what you're supposed to do.

It is completely impossible for the body to break these down with that medicine. You become thinner and thinner, but the oils they consist of and do the toxic job. Yes, this was actually a very important message. And as she said, she is afraid we will see a lot of metabolic change in those who use Osempex. That you use it for a while and then you stop and then you want to

You will get more fat, but you will still break down both your muscles and the bone structure of your skeleton. This can be a huge problem as long as you continue to eat exactly the same when you go to Osempic. What is important is that you do it at a cost, cut the vegetable oils completely out, then it will probably be a much greater help.

We also talked about hypoglycemia, which is low blood sugar. You have too little sugar, and the brain wants to use the most sugar. But you have too little, and you feel like you're craving, you get poor energy, you get angry and you get what they call hangry, that you're both hungry and angry in the same way. So it becomes a bit mannish. And this is the brain that doesn't get enough stimuli. And we also talked about insulin resistance.

We did. Her new theory here, I struggled a bit to get what was new, but it was this energy model of insulin resistance. She has spent a lot of time studying and researching, and it is a completely new theory or formulation of insulin resistance.

And what we know about insulin resistance, when insulin hormones stop taking the signals it needs to be healthy and good, you can go on for years without symptoms, before the symptoms come, before you get sick. So all of this is connected. But in the end, we talked about this with families and children, and what is a healthy diet, and we are back to the same thing all the time, what to eat.

Yes, because as long as the children live at home, it is we who decide what comes on the table. I don't know if it's as bad in Norway, but in the USA, everything children eat is ultra-processed food. It's very often for breakfast with cereals or...

knækkebrød, kaker, crackers, these goldfishes, all of this contains vegetable oils. So what she said, just cut it out and give the children proper food, get them proteins and fats for breakfast, so they don't get hangry at 10 o'clock at school, but they will keep themselves to lunch.

And then, the hunger is one thing, and the humor and the cognitive, so you don't get what's happening at school and in the family. But we parents also have to know that we cause metabolic problems when we take in these foods. And there was one thing I heard that I hadn't thought of before. I've actually never thought of it. It might be good that you've done it, because sometimes I buy granola.

I'm very good at reading ingredients, but I've never thought about reading vegetables oil on granules. Now I do it automatically, but I haven't thought about it, because I just automatically thought it was clean. But that's what I do with all the granules I buy for the family. Goldfish, I ate it at the cinema when I was little. There's too much of it everywhere. So the message here is...

I didn't trust anyone else but your own decision to teach your children to become biohackers. Go back and listen to the episode with Dr. Melissa Saunders, who has children at a biohacking school in Miami. It's possible to make some changes. I thought of her all the time when she talked about the school system. I have studied in the USA myself, and I remember the canteen was full of food. You were healthy and healthy, to put it that way.

So, if you are more than interested in this, I would really recommend you to make one investment on this book called Dark Calories. It is for you to be only in English.

Eventuelt låner du noen, kjøper en e-bok, del budskapet så godt du kan. Husk også at i denne boken er det ikke bare teori, det er en ganske lettlest god bok på mange steder i kapitlene. Du får en egen måte å lage ingredienser. Hun kalte det for at shoppinglisten din

Yes, so read the book, get a lot of inspiration to continue this vegetable oil war we are facing. We wish you all a really good week. Yes, track it, hack it!

We remind you that you must speak to your own doctor or diet manager about diets and other questions related to medicines and supplements. Information we share can not be used to diagnose, treat, prevent or cure any diseases or conditions.

Always looking forward to something good. Hilsenås i spar.

New episode of Relationship Podden, out now. Relationship Podden doesn't take summer vacation. We answer all kinds of questions about relationships that come to us. It can be a problem with a husband-daughter relationship, the boring colleague, the sour neighbor, or the hopeless girlfriend. Fresh challenges for everyone and every Thursday throughout the summer. Listen to Relationship Podden for free, where you listen to podcasts.

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